OK Koch heads... bring your hurt.

I’m glad you folks exist as we need people questioning everything.

However, I have found the “virus doesn’t exist” arguments unconvincing.

The virus isn’t the only cause of disease may have some ground.

I remain open to new papers on this.

Set some rules.
This was established in 1884. Watson & Crick discovered DNA structure in 1953.
He did not contemplate unculturable organisms... the vast majority of organisms are not culture-able.

Viruses by definition cannot be cultured. They require a host cell to culture.

This is where the debate gets dirty.

In order to culture the virus you need to find cells/organisms it can infect but not be a pathogen to those cells.

But Koch wants to demonstrate the pathogen creates symptoms of the disease which be counterproductive to culture.

This is like the uncertainty principle.

The cell line/model organism you choose to culture the virus, can’t be extremely affected by the virus or the culture won’t succeed.

Therefore the vector for the disease is unlikely to be the best place to look for the disease symptoms.

As a result we have folks discounting Vero cell (monkey kidney cells) studies for viral isolation.

By this same logic, all animal models are thus insufficient as well.

Any argument that Vero cells are not identical to patients must also reject all animal models.